PAK FA - VOOU!!!

[Bolovo]

Parece que foram mesmo. Vamos ver o que farão: CAP, ataques de precisão, voos de reconhecimento, demostração, relações públicas? Lembrando que sempre foi normal os russos enviarem projetos em desenvolvimento para operações reais. O Su-25 foi enviado para o Afeganistão em Maio de 1981 e só foi declarado em operação em julho. O Ka-50 lutou nas guerras na Chechênia nos anos 90 mas somente o Ka-52 entrou em operação quase dez anos depois. O Su-34 foi utilizado de maneira limitada na guerra contra a Geórgia em 2008, mas só foi declarado operacional em 2014 e por aí vai. Agora é a vez do Su-57. Nada como uma operação real para adiantar as coisas.

[Túlio]

Parece que foram mesmo. Vamos ver o que farão: CAP, ataques de precisão, voos de reconhecimento, demostração, relações públicas? Lembrando que sempre foi normal os russos enviarem projetos em desenvolvimento para operações reais. O Su-25 foi enviado para o Afeganistão em Maio de 1981 e só foi declarado em operação em julho. O Ka-50 lutou nas guerras na Chechênia nos anos 90 mas somente o Ka-52 entrou em operação quase dez anos depois. O Su-34 foi utilizado de maneira limitada na guerra contra a Geórgia em 2008, mas só foi declarado operacional em 2014 e por aí vai. Agora é a vez do Su-57. Nada como uma operação real para adiantar as coisas.

De acordo. Há ainda o lance de a aeronave já poder ser considerada combat proven antes mesmo de se tornar plenamente operacional, se chegar mesmo a entrar em ação real...

[Marechal-do-ar]

E se for só uma resposta?

tipo, Israel tem F-35, quando derrubaram o F-16 por lá questionaram por que Israel não manda os F-35 na próxima.

Bem, agora eles tem um porquê...

[FCarvalho]

Nada como um dia após o outro no oriente médio... o maior TO operacional ativo há mais de 50 anos.

abs

[EDSON]

Estão dizendo que forma mais dois.

[cabeça de martelo]

Russia’s Stealth-Fighter Deployment in Syria Is a Dangerous Farce

The T-50 isn't ready for combat

Late in the evening on Feb. 21, 2018, a photograph appeared on social media purportedly showing two Russian Sukhoi T-50 prototype stealth fighters — also known as PAK-FAs or Su-57s — in the sky over Hmemmem air base in western Syria.

While the photograph was rather blurry and could not be precisely geo-located, by the morning of Feb. 22 two videos appeared on the same social media depicting almost the same scene. A pair of T-50s escorted by an Su-35 interceptor. The authenticity of the photo and videos is still in question.

But if T-50s are in Syria, it’ll be interesting to see how the Kremlin spins the deployment. Back in November 2017, Russian president Vladimir Putin ordered most of the Russian military contingent in Syria to withdraw, two years after Moscow intervened in the ongoing regional war.

Despite Putin’s order, two T-50s appeared in Syria along with a Russian air force A-50 radar plane, four Su-25 attack planes and four Su-35s fighters. The warplanes arrived in Syria following weeks of intensive air strikes by Russian planes targeting areas controlled by anti-regime rebels in Idlib and East Ghouta.


Late in the evening on Feb. 21, 2018, a photograph appeared on social media purportedly showing two Russian Sukhoi T-50 prototype stealth fighters — also known as PAK-FAs or Su-57s — in the sky over Hmemmem air base in western Syria.

While the photograph was rather blurry and could not be precisely geo-located, by the morning of Feb. 22 two videos appeared on the same social media depicting almost the same scene. A pair of T-50s escorted by an Su-35 interceptor. The authenticity of the photo and videos is still in question.

But if T-50s are in Syria, it’ll be interesting to see how the Kremlin spins the deployment. Back in November 2017, Russian president Vladimir Putin ordered most of the Russian military contingent in Syria to withdraw, two years after Moscow intervened in the ongoing regional war.

Despite Putin’s order, two T-50s appeared in Syria along with a Russian air force A-50 radar plane, four Su-25 attack planes and four Su-35s fighters. The warplanes arrived in Syria following weeks of intensive air strikes by Russian planes targeting areas controlled by anti-regime rebels in Idlib and East Ghouta.


In other words, the T-50s’ deployment could be further proof that Putin’s withdrawal order was a lie.

In any event, the stealth fighters’ presence in Syria raises other questions.

The T-50 program has suffered a number of long delays since the type’s first flight in 2010. Early on, Russian officials announced that the type would undergo state acceptance trials in 2013 and enter operational service in 2015. That didn’t happen. By 2013, the plan was for the T-50 to enter production in late 2016.

To that end, in 2016 the Tikhomirov Scientific Research Institute of Instrument Design completed seven N036 radars designed for T-50s, three of which were installed on prototypes T-50-3, T-50-4 and T-50-5. All of these were in so-called “reduced configuration,” which means they had only a front-facing antenna and lacked the side-looking arrays. There has been no testing of the T-50’s fire-control system nor any kind of live weapons trials for the type.

On the contrary, the T-50 has suffered one failure after another. Most of the first five prototypes have developed severe structural problems, engine breakdowns and mishaps with cockpit glazing. India had agreed to co-finance the T-50, but well-placed Indian sources reported that the T-50’s engines were unreliable, its radar inadequate and its stealth features badly engineered.

Unsurprisingly, Moscow and Sukhoi failed to agree on further Indian financing. The Indians have instead asked for information from the United States regarding its F-35 stealth fighter.

Sukhoi rushed five available T-50 prototypes to the air force’s State Flight Center Base No. 929 at Akthubinsk in September 2016 to have them flight-tested by Russian military pilots. Rumor has it that in the same year, one of the T-50s released a weapon of unknown type from one of its internal stations for the first time. However, no testing was ever confirmed. The prototypes have only appeared carrying dumb bombs or dummy R-77 air-to-air missiles on underwing pylons.

In early 2017, Sukhoi launched development of an entirely new integrated avionics suite for the T-50 designated IMA BK. The original integrated avionics suite, under development since 2004, proved insufficient. The IMA BK suite is years away from entering service.

Later in 2017, Mikhail Pogosian, CEO of United Aircraft Company – the consortium controlling Sukhoi and all of the Russian aviation industry – left his position. Pogosian was the only UAC director with industrial management skills. To say that this collapsed the entire T-50 project would be an understatement. The Ministry of Defense in Moscow in late 2017 slashed T-50 procurement to just 12 copies for now.

These 12 prototypes are supposed to undergo further research and development … by 2025. Considering that Sukhoi has already assembled at least 10 of these, this means that production has essentially been terminated.

In reportedly deploying T-50s, the Kremlin is outright gambling with precious prototypes and their pilots’ lives. It has sent into an active combat zone two supposedly “stealth” fighters that are anything but stealthy, that possess inadequate and incomplete sensors, incomplete fire-control systems and self-protection suites, no operational integrated avionics and are powered by unreliable engines. They have undertaken hardly any weapons-separation testing except for two types of free-fall dumb bombs and lack any other operational weapons bar their 30-millimeter internal cannons.

On the top of that, the aircraft are then going to be flown by pilots who lack any kind of doctrine or tactics for the type and who cannot really depend upon the planes’ avionics and other systems.

https://warisboring.com/russias-stealth ... ous-farce/

[alexmabastos]

Engraçado esse artigo aí em cima. Como se fosse obrigatório um fabricante e desenvolvedor publicar tudo que ocorre num projeto secreto em diário oficial.

[cabeça de martelo]

Foi isso que leu?! Então o seu inglês é diferente do meu...

Enviar um caça que está a ter um desenvolvimento extremamente problemático, ao ponto da própria Índia ter cada vez mais dúvidas acerca da mesma talvez não seja a estratégia mais aconselhada.

Digo eu, que não percebo nada disto.

[FCarvalho]

Os russos sempre foram meio doidos em termos de desenvolvimento tecnológico. A lógica deles não funciona como no ocidente.
Ademais, nunca se saberá ao certo o que de fato está voando na Síria, e quais seus reais problemas e/ou limitações.
E nada melhor do que um TO real para tentar identificar com maior clareza e rapidez os pontos a serem corrigidos.
Obviamente que ninguém espera que estes aviões entrem em combate com caças ocidentais, claro, mas a simples suspeita de que estão no país com certeza terá efeitos bastante interessantes a se observar nas operações aéreas da Otan na Síria e no Iraque.
E isso sem precisar disparar um único tiro.

abs

[EDSON]

Como deve ficar com os novos motores.




E por falar em motor o artigo antes mostrado fala sobre os motores com problemas mas esqueceu de dizer é que estes motores são so Su35 o ALF-41 que é amplamente testado.

[EDSON]

[Poti]

Russia’s Stealth-Fighter Deployment in Syria Is a Dangerous Farce

The T-50 isn't ready for combat

Late in the evening on Feb. 21, 2018, a photograph appeared on social media purportedly showing two Russian Sukhoi T-50 prototype stealth fighters — also known as PAK-FAs or Su-57s — in the sky over Hmemmem air base in western Syria.

While the photograph was rather blurry and could not be precisely geo-located, by the morning of Feb. 22 two videos appeared on the same social media depicting almost the same scene. A pair of T-50s escorted by an Su-35 interceptor. The authenticity of the photo and videos is still in question.

But if T-50s are in Syria, it’ll be interesting to see how the Kremlin spins the deployment. Back in November 2017, Russian president Vladimir Putin ordered most of the Russian military contingent in Syria to withdraw, two years after Moscow intervened in the ongoing regional war.

Despite Putin’s order, two T-50s appeared in Syria along with a Russian air force A-50 radar plane, four Su-25 attack planes and four Su-35s fighters. The warplanes arrived in Syria following weeks of intensive air strikes by Russian planes targeting areas controlled by anti-regime rebels in Idlib and East Ghouta.


Late in the evening on Feb. 21, 2018, a photograph appeared on social media purportedly showing two Russian Sukhoi T-50 prototype stealth fighters — also known as PAK-FAs or Su-57s — in the sky over Hmemmem air base in western Syria.

While the photograph was rather blurry and could not be precisely geo-located, by the morning of Feb. 22 two videos appeared on the same social media depicting almost the same scene. A pair of T-50s escorted by an Su-35 interceptor. The authenticity of the photo and videos is still in question.

But if T-50s are in Syria, it’ll be interesting to see how the Kremlin spins the deployment. Back in November 2017, Russian president Vladimir Putin ordered most of the Russian military contingent in Syria to withdraw, two years after Moscow intervened in the ongoing regional war.

Despite Putin’s order, two T-50s appeared in Syria along with a Russian air force A-50 radar plane, four Su-25 attack planes and four Su-35s fighters. The warplanes arrived in Syria following weeks of intensive air strikes by Russian planes targeting areas controlled by anti-regime rebels in Idlib and East Ghouta.


In other words, the T-50s’ deployment could be further proof that Putin’s withdrawal order was a lie.

In any event, the stealth fighters’ presence in Syria raises other questions.

The T-50 program has suffered a number of long delays since the type’s first flight in 2010. Early on, Russian officials announced that the type would undergo state acceptance trials in 2013 and enter operational service in 2015. That didn’t happen. By 2013, the plan was for the T-50 to enter production in late 2016.

To that end, in 2016 the Tikhomirov Scientific Research Institute of Instrument Design completed seven N036 radars designed for T-50s, three of which were installed on prototypes T-50-3, T-50-4 and T-50-5. All of these were in so-called “reduced configuration,” which means they had only a front-facing antenna and lacked the side-looking arrays. There has been no testing of the T-50’s fire-control system nor any kind of live weapons trials for the type.

On the contrary, the T-50 has suffered one failure after another. Most of the first five prototypes have developed severe structural problems, engine breakdowns and mishaps with cockpit glazing. India had agreed to co-finance the T-50, but well-placed Indian sources reported that the T-50’s engines were unreliable, its radar inadequate and its stealth features badly engineered.

Unsurprisingly, Moscow and Sukhoi failed to agree on further Indian financing. The Indians have instead asked for information from the United States regarding its F-35 stealth fighter.

Sukhoi rushed five available T-50 prototypes to the air force’s State Flight Center Base No. 929 at Akthubinsk in September 2016 to have them flight-tested by Russian military pilots. Rumor has it that in the same year, one of the T-50s released a weapon of unknown type from one of its internal stations for the first time. However, no testing was ever confirmed. The prototypes have only appeared carrying dumb bombs or dummy R-77 air-to-air missiles on underwing pylons.

In early 2017, Sukhoi launched development of an entirely new integrated avionics suite for the T-50 designated IMA BK. The original integrated avionics suite, under development since 2004, proved insufficient. The IMA BK suite is years away from entering service.

Later in 2017, Mikhail Pogosian, CEO of United Aircraft Company – the consortium controlling Sukhoi and all of the Russian aviation industry – left his position. Pogosian was the only UAC director with industrial management skills. To say that this collapsed the entire T-50 project would be an understatement. The Ministry of Defense in Moscow in late 2017 slashed T-50 procurement to just 12 copies for now.

These 12 prototypes are supposed to undergo further research and development … by 2025. Considering that Sukhoi has already assembled at least 10 of these, this means that production has essentially been terminated.

In reportedly deploying T-50s, the Kremlin is outright gambling with precious prototypes and their pilots’ lives. It has sent into an active combat zone two supposedly “stealth” fighters that are anything but stealthy, that possess inadequate and incomplete sensors, incomplete fire-control systems and self-protection suites, no operational integrated avionics and are powered by unreliable engines. They have undertaken hardly any weapons-separation testing except for two types of free-fall dumb bombs and lack any other operational weapons bar their 30-millimeter internal cannons.

On the top of that, the aircraft are then going to be flown by pilots who lack any kind of doctrine or tactics for the type and who cannot really depend upon the planes’ avionics and other systems.

https://warisboring.com/russias-stealth ... ous-farce/

Achei esse artigo curioso. Não tenho dúvidas que problemas devem estar acontecendo. Desenvolvimento de projetos de alta tecnologia passam sempre por dificuldades e os russos estão dando um pulo de caças como SU30-35S para aviões de baixa assinatura radar.
Daí a apresentar como fracassos (failure) creio que é dificilmente defensável. Os caras fabricaram motores do Mig 9 ao Su35S, qual razão para fracassarem agora?
Fabricam radares embarcados há décadas, com PESA, AESA em aviões como o Su30 e Su35s, por qual razão fracassariam agora? Daí em diante...
Se fosse um país sem experiência em aeronaves de combate eu concordaria mas acho difícil ver esses fracassos todos.
E repito, não tenho dúvida de que o projeto passa por muitas dificuldades, mas acho que a descrença no artigo está demasiadamente intensa.
Lembrou-me o General francês de Castries en Dien Bien Phu que ao receber informações de que o Vietminh estava levando uma quantidade gigantesca de obuseiros para a região e achou que era técnicamente impossível a artilharia vietnamita ser eficaz (por questões ligadas ao terreno, formação dos vietnamitas e logísticas).
Em 10mn a sua melhor unidade, 13 DBLE da Legião (famosa por Bir Hakeim) foi para o espaço ao tomar uma barragem de artilharia gigantesca e certeira. O resto é História...

[alexmabastos]

Foi isso que leu?! Então o seu inglês é diferente do meu...

Enviar um caça que está a ter um desenvolvimento extremamente problemático, ao ponto da própria Índia ter cada vez mais dúvidas acerca da mesma talvez não seja a estratégia mais aconselhada.

Digo eu, que não percebo nada disto.

Não é uma questão de saber inglês ou não. A questão é saber exatamente o que foi para a Síria e com que capacidade. Quais os ganhos dos últimos anos em desenvolvimento, o que é jogado na mídia para desinformação etc etc.

Querem ter certeza sobre desenvolvimentos secretos pela mídia ou por artigos? Tá brincando né....

O negócio é esperar para ver o que farão e como se sairão lá....depois tenha suas certezas.

[Bolovo]

Estou numa vibe de Guerra Fria vendo essas.fotos...
Em que tempos vivemos!

[P44]

Nada como testar onde há ação