Fórum Defesa Brasil

triste...... parece que eu sou do PSDB...ou do DEM...

O FX é importante demais para ser usado como compensação à escolha do STucano.

Voto por 0% de chance ao ST, torcendo ainda pelo lobby da Beech !!!

Salu2.

Nem a pau, Juvenal!!! 0,00%

entre 0% e 0,000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000001%

Basta ver a história recente de "concursos internacionais" da USAF

http://www.flightglobal.com/blogs/the-d ... to-be.html

Com direito a vídeo.

Se chegar a ter 0% já seria muito...

No chance...

Se for escolhido também, nem muda muita coisa, a maior parte dele já é feita lá mesmo.

An Historic PR “fumble” in the Super Tucano Vs AT-6 Public Fight

By Ed Timperlake

May 26, 2011

Currently the U.S. Air Force is engaged in a source selection process to pick a Light Attack Support Aircraft (LAS) for the emerging Afghan National Army Air Corps.

The Super Tucano is the only platform with proven combat success in fighting against both the communist FARC guerillas in Colombia and drug kingpins operating across borders in South America. (http://www.sldforum.com/2011/05/all-else-is-rubbish/).

The AT-6, the other LAS in consideration, is not yet even certified for ordnance release.

So what exactly has been the PR strategy for the AT-6?

An opening salvo was fired by Mr. Richard Michalski, general vice president of the International Association of Machinists and Aerospace Workers (IAM&AW) and was posted in The Hill Congressional Blog. For some reason he focused on both a buy America argument while also attacking Embraer Air for not being cognizant of the ejection seat ergonomics for female fighter pilots. For a country with a female President this was truly strange.

The echo chamber supporting him in the comment section made two astonishing statements:

First was an attack on the Second Line of Defense article in which I had placed a picture of a Super Tucano female pilot in the Brazil AF (http://www.sldinfo.com/?p=17758)

The second point made in support of Mr. Michalski essentially captures the overall line of support currently in play that argues it is good for the American worker to select the American AT-6 over the Super Tucano.

Soon there appeared other articles in print stressing the need to protect the American worker and adding an additional point about the supply chain strength of building the AT-6 in America

(See for example http://www.lexingtoninstitute.org/at-6- ... a=1&c=1171)

“A final and not unimportant point is that unlike some of the other contenders for the LAAR role, the Hawker Beechcraft AT-6 would be developed, produced and assembled in the United States. The entire supply chain would be secure, safe and American. The AT-6 is a low-risk, low-cost solution that avoids the political, logistical and operational challenges that would inevitably arise if a foreign-built aircraft were selected as the LAAR.”

Or see http://www.lexingtoninstitute.org/penta ... a=1&c=1171).

“There are only two credible contenders for the contract: an American plane made by Hawker Beechcraft designated the AT-6, and a Brazilian plane made by Embraer designated the EMB-314. They’re both propeller driven, multi-mission aircraft, and their price-tags are similar. But because the Beechcraft offering would be developed and assembled in America, it would generate over 1,000 jobs here. The Brazilian plane would be developed elsewhere, and final assembly in the U.S. would probably generate less than a hundred jobs.”

Concurrently, along with buy-America and supply chain arguments in play the next PR strategy was to stress the advanced systems on the AT-6. In a front page Aviation Week story a HBC pilot let the reader believe that the lone (1600shp) AT-6 in existence wakes up every morning and thinks it is an A-10

AT-6 Seen As Versatile Combat Aircraft By David Fulghum (Av Week) May 18 2011:

“Now, as the AT-6B/C, it is promising to become an inexpensive path to network-centric operations, precision strike and advanced surveillance for other air forces.

Nor is there a foreseeable end to the development potential envisioned for the two-seater. It offers 1,600 shp, 5-6-hr. endurance and an A-10C cockpit—a combination that’s being created by the team of Hawker Beechcraft and Lockheed Martin.

As for what a light attack platform should be, the debate is over, declares Daniel Hinson, AT-6 demonstration and test manager and chief test pilot. The answer, he contends, is an affordable manned platform that is toughened to the demands of pilot training and that lends itself to integrating niche features that include precision weapons as well as advanced intelligence, surveillance and reconnaissance (ISR) capabilities.”

Unfortunately, for the advanced “tron” argument the AT-6 has bumped into some unforgiving laws of aerodynamics that were recently pointed to the very knowledgeable and prestigious Association of Old Crows.

The Association of Old Crows (AOC) sponsored a symposium in Arlington in May 2011 on the AT-6, and the laws of physics were made in a very direct way:

No RWR (Radar Warning Receiver) installed. Significant weight and balance (CG) and overall weight challenges associated with MWS (Missile warning System) installation Aircraft is tail heavy; ballast had to be installed forward to re-align CG Ballast detracts from overall aircraft payload

To summarize on the demonstrated Combat capability of both aircraft:

The Super Tucano is a proven combat aircraft that is currently killing Communists and drug kingpins; and The AT-6 is not yet certified to drop ordnance and pays a price in support in just trying to defend itself in a limited threat environment.

As much as I enjoyed the open and fair debate on capabilities, the AT-6 supporters were just handed a huge OOPSIE by HBC management and their investment banker owners (49% US, 49% Canada, 2% corporate officers).

American Interests Come First, Not Brazil’s When It Comes To National Security
May, 12, 2011 — nicedeb

Photo via Aviation News

Next month, the Dept. of Defense will be deciding between two companies competing for an Air Force contract – the Hawker Beechcraft AT-6 and the Brazilian owned Embraer Super Tucano.

Why would they even consider outsourcing national security to a foreign company, subsidized by a government that has been unhelpful to the United States in the war on terror?

As Stephen DeMaura at RedState noted:

The Brazilian government’s direct control over Embraer would put the production of the light attack and reconnaissance aircraft at the mercy and whim of Brazil’s political leaders who too often do not see eye to eye with the United States on foreign policy issues. In fact, they have been noticeably absent from the War on Terror over the last decade. The same War on Terror from which they are now seeking to profit.

New Mexico State Senator William (Bill) H. Payne, a retired Rear Admiral (SEAL) in the United States Navy made the case for the Hawker Beechcraft AT-6, arguing that the United States is not in a position economically to provide jobs to foreign governments:

From the perspective of the American Legislative Exchange Council (ALEC) the decision is clear. Both aircraft are mission appropriate and cost roughly the same. However the acquisition of Hawker Beechcraft’s AT-6 has the added benefit of upholding ALEC’s free-market principles and creating significantly more American jobs – 1,400 spread across 18 states.

***

In 2009, the United States Air Force (USAF) issued a request for a new type of aircraft that could successfully perform light attack and armed reconnaissance (LAAR) missions. After reviewing numerous proposals and conducting extensive research, the USAF determined that the two leading contenders are Hawker Beechcraft’s AT-6 and Embraer’s Super Tucano. Hawker Beechcraft is an American company headquartered in Wichita, Kansas, while Embraer is a Brazilian company.

Embraer is heavily subsidized by the Brazilian government and is being supported by their Financing Agency for Studies and Projects (FINEP), which is helping to fund the research and development of this fleet. In fact, the aircraft that Embraer used in a recent demonstration for the USAF is actually owned by the Brazilian Air Force and was fully supported by them during their test runs. In contrast, Hawker Beechcraft has invested its own resources into the development, assembly, and flight demonstrations for their AT-6 aircraft.

In addition, the Brazilian government continues to hold what is known as a “Golden Share” in Embraer, which allows them to maintain an aggressive and active role in the governance of the company. It grants them veto power over previously agreed-upon stipulations of their contracts, including interruption in the supply of maintenance and replacement parts for military aircraft sold abroad.

This scenario is reminiscent of the recent $35 billion contract awarded to Boeing, which was locked in competition for years with European rival EADS to provide refueling tankers to the USAF. In Boeing’s case, its contract proposal was accepted because it is a longstanding and trusted aircraft provider with a superior product and existing production capabilities here in America. The Boeing Company has earned the confidence of our modern military and has a vested interest in serving and protecting our country. Their contract win also supports American jobs—some 44,000 in more than 40 states with over 300 suppliers.

Hawker Beechcraft possesses a profile very similar to Boeing’s. Hawker Beechcraft has a lengthy history of producing aircraft for both civilian and military use and has already successfully provided warplanes to the USAF and other branches of our military. It is a private, American enterprise that is participating in a joint venture with Lockheed Martin as it competes for this contract.

Aviation Week recently did a story on the Hawker Beechcraft AT-6:

For the Hawker Beechcraft/Lockheed Martin AT-6 light attack aircraft team, the mantra is to produce the right weapon effects.

“If you are talking about counterinsurgency target sets, you want to be able to pick the right weapon and precisely place it where and when it needs to be there,” says Dan Hinson, AT-6 demonstration and test manager and chief test pilot for the team. “That requires persistence and network-centric command and control.”

The team is competing against Embraer with the Super Tucano to supply 20 Light Support Aircraft to Afghanistan and potentially 15 aircraft to the U.S. Air Force for use in training foreign air forces.

For more endurance, the team is looking at ways to add fuel without diminishing capability.

“We are working on putting 325 pounds of extra internal fuel in the wings, which would give another 45 minutes to an hour of flight,” Hinson says. “I flew four to six hours and still had 400 pounds of gas. That was with the EO/IR [electro-optic/infrared] turret and external fuel tanks, but not weapons.

“If the mission is ISR [intelligence, surveillance and reconnaissance], we can stand out there a long time,” Hinson continues. “Five hours is very doable and four is a pretty good standard. Being able to hang out in the battle with the same guys on station without having to cycle out for inflight refueling provides an amazing [amount of continuity] for an airborne mission.”

Should the DoD give Hawker Beechcraft the contract, that would create 1400 jobs in America, while giving Embraer the contract would only create 50 jobs in America and the rest in Brazil.

One more thing: The Hawker Beechcraft AT-6 would allow for roughly 95% of both the male and female potential pilot population with weights as low as 103 pounds and as high as 245 pounds to safely fly the aircraft. The old standards to which the Brazilian aircraft complies, would prohibit 18% of military males and 81% of military females from safely ejecting from the aircraft in an emergency.

To me, this is a no-brainer.

When American Companies Face Foreign Government-Subsidized Competitors

By State Senator William (Bill) H. Payne

America is currently engaged in battle on multiple fronts. We are fighting to grow our economy and provide jobs for our people while striving to be good world citizens and attractive trading partners. Fortunately, these goals are synergistic where success in any one of them brings us that much closer to realizing the others. For the principles that underpin genuine free markets and limited government have the power to propel economic prosperity worldwide.

As early as June 2011, the Department of Defense will decide between two competing aircraft to conduct light attack and armed reconnaissance (LAAR) and light air support (LAS) missions – the Hawker Beechcraft AT-6 and the Embraer Super Tucano. From the perspective of the American Legislative Exchange Council (ALEC) the decision is clear. Both aircraft are mission appropriate and cost roughly the same. However the acquisition of Hawker Beechcraft’s AT-6 has the added benefit of upholding ALEC’s free-market principles and creating significantly more American jobs – 1,400 spread across 18 states.

Cognizant that increasing international trade is the surest path to economic recovery, a key element of the Administration’s strategy involves forging ties with current and emerging powers in an effort to nurture successful trade relationships. The President’s priorities were on full display during his March 2011 Latin American trip which included obvious courting of government officials in Brazil. However, it cannot be overstated that economic competition between nations must take place on a level playing field, where companies have similar access to technology and innovation funding to support their efforts and where the marketplace determines the competitive outcome with minimal government interference and subsidization. Especially with respect to procurement, the government has a duty to scrutinize bids to ensure that the competition between bidding entities is fair and that we are not inadvertently rewarding companies whose adherence to the free market principles is tenuous. This is in keeping with ALEC’s commitment to free markets and limited government. Unfair competition between private companies and government subsidized enterprises is dealt with specifically in our Public-Private Fair Competition Act.

In 2009, the United States Air Force (USAF) issued a request for a new type of aircraft that could successfully perform light attack and armed reconnaissance (LAAR) missions. After reviewing numerous proposals and conducting extensive research, the USAF determined that the two leading contenders are Hawker Beechcraft’s AT-6 and Embraer’s Super Tucano. Hawker Beechcraft is an American company headquartered in Wichita, Kansas, while Embraer is a Brazilian company.

Embraer is heavily subsidized by the Brazilian government and is being supported by their Financing Agency for Studies and Projects (FINEP), which is helping to fund the research and development of this fleet. In fact, the aircraft that Embraer used in a recent demonstration for the USAF is actually owned by the Brazilian Air Force and was fully supported by them during their test runs. In contrast, Hawker Beechcraft has invested its own resources into the development, assembly, and flight demonstrations for their AT-6 aircraft.

In addition, the Brazilian government continues to hold what is known as a “Golden Share” in Embraer, which allows them to maintain an aggressive and active role in the governance of the company. It grants them veto power over previously agreed-upon stipulations of their contracts, including interruption in the supply of maintenance and replacement parts for military aircraft sold abroad.

This scenario is reminiscent of the recent $35 billion contract awarded to Boeing, which was locked in competition for years with European rival EADS to provide refueling tankers to the USAF. In Boeing’s case, its contract proposal was accepted because it is a longstanding and trusted aircraft provider with a superior product and existing production capabilities here in America. The Boeing Company has earned the confidence of our modern military and has a vested interest in serving and protecting our country. Their contract win also supports American jobs—some 44,000 in more than 40 states with over 300 suppliers.

Hawker Beechcraft possesses a profile very similar to Boeing’s. Hawker Beechcraft has a lengthy history of producing aircraft for both civilian and military use and has already successfully provided warplanes to the USAF and other branches of our military. It is a private, American enterprise that is participating in a joint venture with Lockheed Martin as it competes for this contract.

Hawker Beechcraft’s T-6 trainer which served as the template for the new AT-6 being developed for LAAR missions has exceeded one million flight hours, with 500 units manufactured and delivered. The popular T-6 trainer aircraft is currently being flown by the USAF, United States Navy, Hellenic Air Force of Greece, NATO Flight Training in Canada, and the Israeli Air Force. This familiarity makes it a popular choice among those who would fly and maintain it, and it enjoys a broad support network with unimpeded access to parts whenever and wherever needed. Needless to say Hawker Beechcraft has a proven track record of success at home and with our allied forces.

Hawker Beechcraft will develop and produce the AT-6 in the United States, supporting over 1,400 jobs and employing suppliers in 18 states to work on this program. In contrast, Embraer’s EMB-314 Tucano will be developed and built primarily in Brazil, with a miserly 50 final assembly positions being filled in the U.S.

However, in this David vs. Goliath story it is clear Hawker Beechcraft is not competing with just another aircraft company but rather with a semi-privatized foreign entity – a situation that is inconsistent with ALEC’s guiding principles and our Public-Private Fair Competition Act. I am hard pressed to understand why the U.S. Department of Defense is considering awarding a contract to a company that is heavily subsidized and supported by a foreign government. This is akin to entrusting America’s security to a foreign government. If awarded the contract, the Golden Share that the Brazilian government holds in Embraer will enable it to disrupt service and replacement parts at will. Brazilian national security priorities, which are often not aligned with ours, could trigger such a disruption. Undue influence from countries which are potential U.S. adversaries but strong Brazilian trading partners could also result in our not receiving the materiel for which we contracted raises national security questions as well.

Developing strong trading ties with other countries is an economic imperative. However we must ensure that the companies with which the U.S. government does business adhere to the same free market, limited government principles that characterize American enterprises. And while we can actively court new trading partners, we cannot allow the game to be fixed in their favor. Free markets are a highly positive force but competition between privately-held and government-subsidized entities is a distortion of the free market system and encourages the very government interventionism that ALEC opposes.

If we don’t look out for our national interest, no one else will. The United States is in no position economically to provide jobs to foreign governments or to subsidize their growth. Growing our own economy is enough of a challenge. This is why we must act to promote and enforce a fair interaction between private enterprise and government influenced foreign entities like Embraer. In other words, we want to make certain that when it comes to government procurement apples are competing against apples.

New Mexico State Senator William (Bill) H. Payne is the Senate Minority Whip and represents Senate District 20. He is a retired Rear Admiral (SEAL) in the United States Navy and his last flag assignment was as the Deputy Director for Strategy, Plans and Policy, U.S. Central Command. Senator Payne is also a member of ALEC’s International Relations Task Force.

O loby é feio, mas pelo menos nos livraremos com desembaraço das pressões do F-18!

J.Ricardo escreveu:O loby é feio, mas pelo menos nos livraremos com desembaraço das pressões do F-18!

Vai nessa...coleira em todo lugar, basta cortar as peças de F5 e já era...

Podem esquecer por um bom tempo essa compra. A FAB não tem recursos pra nada!! O que está acontecendo em Brasília é surpreendente: estão suspensas as educações físicas para economizar água( a conta não é paga a 5 meses),a luz só pode ligar em determinados períodos por dia(boa parte do dia fica desligada), telefonemas estão hípercontrolados, provavelmente a partir da próxima semana haverá meio-expediente por falta de rancho.

J.Ricardo escreveu:O loby é feio, mas pelo menos nos livraremos com desembaraço das pressões do F-18!

joao fernando escreveu:Vai nessa...coleira em todo lugar, basta cortar as peças de F5 e já era...

Não se esqueça das peças de Bandeco...

joao fernando escreveu:

J.Ricardo escreveu:O loby é feio, mas pelo menos nos livraremos com desembaraço das pressões do F-18!

Vai nessa...coleira em todo lugar, basta cortar as peças de F5 e já era...

Bem, do meu ponto de vista este seria um grande favor que nos fariam .


Leandro G. Card

LeandroGCard escreveu:

joao fernando escreveu: Vai nessa...coleira em todo lugar, basta cortar as peças de F5 e já era...

Bem, do meu ponto de vista este seria um grande favor que nos fariam .


Leandro G. Card

Quanta maldade no coração.

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