O melhor carro de combate do mundo

Assuntos em discussão: Exército Brasileiro e exércitos estrangeiros, armamentos, equipamentos de exércitos em geral.

Moderadores: J.Ricardo, Conselho de Moderação

Qual o melhor carro de combate do mundo?

1-Osório
19
32%
2-Merkava
13
22%
3-Chalenger
0
Não há votos registrados
4-Challenger
5
8%
5-T-90
23
38%
 
Total de votos: 60

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LEO
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#16 Mensagem por LEO » Dom Set 21, 2003 3:28 pm

É verdade, eu tinha olhado olhei neste site que você postou (e que por coincidencia eu iria postar tambémmm) e agora eu vi que é 152mm, e não 135mm.
Mas a página que eu vi estava desatualizada e por isso... já viu, né... :roll:


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#17 Mensagem por Spetsnaz » Dom Set 21, 2003 3:40 pm

LEOPARD 2 MAIN BATTLE TANK, GERMANY
The Leopard 2 is a main battle tank developed by Krauss-Maffei AG, now Krauss-Maffei Wegmann (KMW), of Munchen, Germany. The Leopard 2 is a successor to the successful Leopard 1.

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PROGRAMME

The Leopard 1 was first produced in 1963 by Krauss-Maffei for the German Ministry of Defence and more than 6,000 vehicles have been exported to Belgium, Denmark, Germany, Greece, Italy, Canada, the Netherlands, Norway, Turkey and Australia. The successor to the Leopard 1, the Leopard 2, was first produced in 1979 and is in service with the armies of Austria, Denmark, Germany, the Netherlands, Norway, Switzerland, Sweden and Spain, with over 3,200 produced. The Finnish Army is buying 124 and the Polish Army 128 used Leopard 2A4 tanks from Germany.

The Leopard 2A6 includes longer L55 gun, an auxiliary engine, improved mine protection and an air-conditioning system. The German Army is upgrading 225 2A5 tanks to 2A6 configuration, the first of which was delivered in March 2001. The Royal Netherlands Army has ordered the upgrade of 180 of its 2A5 tanks to 2A6 configuration, the first of which entered service in February 2003. Spain has ordered 219 Leopard 2A6. The first 30 are being built by KMW, the rest will be license-built in Spain by General Dynamics, Santa Barbara Sistemas (GDSBS). Deliveries of the first batch are expected by the end of 2003. In March 2003, the Hellenic Army of Greece ordered 170 Leopard 2 HEL (a version of the 2A6EX) for delivery between 2006 and 2009.

Another variant is the Leopard 2(S), which has a new command and control system and new passive armour system. 120 Leopard 2(S) have been delivered to the Swedish Army. Deliveries concluded in March 2002.

CONSTRUCTION

The hull is in three sections: 1) the driving compartment at the front, 2) the fighting section in the centre, and 3) the engine at the rear of the vehicle.

The driver's compartment is equipped with three observation periscopes. Space to the left of the driver is provided for ammunition stowage. A camera with a 65° horizontal and vertical field of view positioned at the rear of the vehicle and a television monitor provide a reversing aid for the driver.

The turret is located in the centre of the vehicle. There is an improvement programme which provides third generation composite armour, and the additional reinforcement to the turret frontal and lateral armour with externally mounted add-on armour modules. In the event of weapon penetration through the armour, the spall liner reduces the number of fragments and narrows the fragment cone. The spall liner also provides noise and thermal insulation. The reinforcement provides protection against multiple strike, kinetic energy rounds and shaped charges.

FIRE CONTROL

The commander's station has an independent periscope, a PERI-R 17 A2 from STN Atlas Elektronik and Zeiss Optronik GmbH. The PERI-R 17 A2 is a stabilised panoramic periscope sight for day/night observation and target identification, and it provides an all round view with a traverse of 360°. The thermal image from the commander's periscope is displayed on a monitor. The PERI-R17 A2 can also be used for weapon firing as it is slaved into the tank's fire control system. The image from the gunner's thermal sight can also be transmitted to the commander's PERI-R17 periscope so the commander can switch the gunner's video image to the commander's monitor. This enables the commander and the gunner to have access to the same field of view of the combat range.

The gunner's station is equipped with an STN Atlas Elektronik EMES 15 dual magnification stabilised primary sight. The primary sight has an integrated laser rangefinder and a Zeiss Optronik thermal sight, model WBG-X, which are both linked to the tank's fire control computer. The thermal sight uses standard US Army common modules, with 120 element cadmium mercury telluride, CdHgTe (also known as CMT) infra-red detector array operating in the 8 to 14 micron waveband. The infra-red detector unit is cooled with a Stirling closed-cycle engine.

The sight is fitted with a CE628 laser rangefinder from Zeiss Optronik. The laser is a Neodinium Yttrium Aluminium Garnet, (Nd:YAG) solid state laser. The rangefinder can provide up to three range values in four seconds. The range data is transmitted to the fire control computer and is used to calculate the firing algorithms. Also, because the laser rangefinder is integrated into the gunner's primary sight, the gunner can read the digital range measurement directly. The maximum range of the laser rangefinder is less than 10,000m with accuracy to within 20m.

The command and fire control procedure known as first echo selection is used for laser rangefinding for anti-helicopter operations. The principal weapon uses electronic firing to reduce reaction times.

MAIN ARMAMENT

A new smoothbore gun, the 120 millimetre L55 Gun, has been developed by Rheinmetall GmbH of Ratingen, Germany to replace the shorter 120mm L44 smoothbore tankgun on the Leopard 2. The extension of the barrel length from calibre length 44 to calibre length 55 results in a greater portion of the available energy in the barrel being converted into projectile velocity increasing the range and armour penetration. The L55 smoothbore gun, equipped with a thermal sleeve, a fume extractor and a muzzle reference system, is compatible with current 120mm ammunition and new high penetration ammunition. An improved kinetic energy ammunition known as LKE 2 DM53 was developed as a result of a Tactical Requirement issued in November 1987, and uses the longer gun barrel. With the DM53 round the L55 gun can fire to a range of 5,000m. The effect of the kinetic energy projectile on an enemy target is achieved by 1) the penetrator length and projectile mass and the impact velocity and 2) the interaction between the projectile and the target. The penetrator material is heavy tungsten powder in a monoblock structure. The improved kinetic energy ammunition has higher muzzle energy and recoil forces.

NAVIGATION SYSTEMS

The Leopard 2 is equipped with a land navigation system from the company LITEF of Bonn, Germany which is a subsidiary of Northrop Grumman (formerly Litton) of USA. The hybrid navigation system consists of a Global Positioning System (GPS) and an inertial navigation system.

SUPPORT SYSTEMS

A programme has been put in place to replace the H-WNA improved hydraulic system with E-WNA which is an electrical weapon follow-up system. The replacement with the E-WNA provides the following advantages: 1) the turret has no pressurised hydraulic fluid, 2) lower noise level and lower power consumption and heat generation, 3) improved reliability and lower maintenance and service requirements, 4) saving in operating costs and 5) good long term storage properties.

The crew compartment is equipped with a fire and explosion detection and suppression system which has been licensed by the company Deugra Ges. fur Brandschutzsysteme of Ratingen, Germany from the UK company Kidde-Graviner of Slough, Berkshire. A fireproof bulkhead separates the fighting compartment from the engine compartment at the rear of the vehicle.

ENGINE

The engine is the MTU MB 873 diesel engine, providing 1,100kW (1,500shp), with a Renk HSWL 354 gear and break system. An enhanced version of the EuroPowerPack, with a 1,210kW (1,650shp) MTU MT883 engine, has been trialled on the Leopard 2.




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#18 Mensagem por Spetsnaz » Dom Set 21, 2003 3:41 pm

CHALLENGER 2 MAIN BATTLE TANK, UNITED KINGDOM
Challenger 2 is an advanced main battle tank built by the UK company, Alvis Vickers Ltd (formerly Vickers Defence Systems). Challenger 2 is in service with the British Army and with the Royal Army of Oman. The UK placed orders for 127 Challenger 2 tanks in 1991 and an additional 259 in 1994. In 1993 Oman ordered 18 Challenger 2 tanks and an order for a further 20 tanks was placed in November 1997. British Army Challenger 2 tanks were deployed on active service in Operation Iraqi Freedom.

Challenger 2 entered service with the British Army in June 1998 and the last of the 386 tanks was delivered in April 2002. Deliveries for Oman were completed in 2001. Challenger 2 has seen operational service in Bosnia and Kosovo.

Challenger 2E, the latest development model, has been designed for the export market and is suitable for harsh environmental and climactic conditions. The 2E has been extensively trialled in Greece, Qatar and Saudi Arabia.

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ARMAMENT

Challenger 2 is equipped with an L30, 120mm rifled tank gun from the Royal Ordnance division of BAE SYSTEMS. The gun is made from electro-slag refined steel (ESR) and is insulated with a thermal sleeve. It is fitted with a muzzle reference system and fume extraction. The turret is capable of 360° rotation and the weapon elevation range is from -10° to +20°.

There is capacity for 50 120mm projectiles, including armour piercing fin-stabilised discarding sabot (APFSDS), high explosive squash head (HESH) or smoke rounds. The L30 gun can also fire the Depleted Uranium (DU) round with a stick charge propellant. With the DU round, the L30 is part of the Charm 1 gun, charge and projectile system. A Charm 3 system is under development in which the DU projectile has a higher length to diameter aspect ratio for increased penetration.

The gun control is provided by an all-electric gun control and stabilisation system from BAE SYSTEMS. Challenger 2 is also equipped with a Boeing 7.62mm chain gun, which is located to the left of the main tank gun. The loader has a 7.62mm GPMG L37A2 anti-air machine gun, mounted on the cupola.

SELF-PROTECTION

The turret is protected with second generation Chobham armour. A nuclear, biological and chemical (NBC) protection system is located in the turret bustle. On each side of the turret are five L8 smoke grenade dischargers, from Helio Mirror Company. Challenger 2 can also set a smoke screen by the injection of diesel fuel into the engine exhausts.

FIRE CONTROL AND OBSERVATION

The digital fire control computer is produced by Computing Devices Company (now General Dynamics - Canada). General Dynamics UK is to supply the Platform Battlefield Information System Application (PBISA) for the British Army Challenger 2 tanks. PBISA integrates the commander's display, inertial navigation system, digitisation processing computer and driver's display panel. Alvis Vickers is responsible for system integration and some of the software. PBISA will be delivered from 2004 to 2006.

The commander has a panoramic VS 580-10 gyrostabilised sight from SAGEM (formerly SFIM Industries). A laser rangefinder is incorporated into an intermediate assembly. Elevation range is +35° to -35°. The commander's station is equipped with eight periscopes which provide 360° vision.

The Thermal Observation and Gunnery Sight II (TOGS II), from Thales (formerly Pilkington) Optronics, provides night vision. The sensor is based on UK TICM 2 common modules. The thermal image, with magnification x 4 and x 11.5 is displayed in the gunner's and commander's sights and monitors. The gunner has a Thales Optronics stabilised Gunner's Primary Sight, consisting of visual channel, 4Hz laser rangefinder and display. The laser rangefinder has a range of 200m to 10km.

The driver is equipped with an image-intensifying Passive Driving Periscope (PDP) from Thales Optronics, for night driving.

PROPULSION

The Challenger 2 has a twelve-cylinder, 1,200hp Perkins Caterpillar CV12 diesel engine and a David Brown TN54 gearbox, with six forward and two reverse gears. Second-generation Hydrogas suspension and hydraulic track tensioner are fitted. The maximum speed by road is 59km/h and 40km/h cross country. The range is given as 450km by road and 250km cross country.

CHALLENGER 2E

Challenger 2E has a new integrated weapon control and battlefield management system, which includes a gyrostabilised panoramic SAGEM MVS 580 day/thermal sight for the commander and SAGEM SAVAN 15 gyrostabilised day/thermal sight for the gunner, both with eyesafe laser rangefinder. This allows hunter/killer operations with a common engagement sequence. An optional servo-controlled overhead weapons platform can be slaved to the commander's sight to allow operation independent from the turret.

The powerpack has been replaced with a new 1500 hp Europack with transversely mounted MTU 883 diesel engine coupled to Renk HSWL 295TM automatic transmission. The smaller but more powerful engine allows more space for fuel storage, increasing the vehicle’s range to 550km




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#19 Mensagem por Spetsnaz » Dom Set 21, 2003 3:42 pm

MERKAVA 4 MAIN BATTLE TANK, ISRAEL
The 65t Merkava 4 main battle tank entered full production in 2001 and began operational training with the Israel Defence Force in July 2003. It will enter service in 2004. The Ministry of Defence will manufacture between 50 and 70 Merkava 4 tanks per year and initial estimates indicate that up to 400 tanks will be manufactured. The Merkava 4 has been extensively improved including new armour protection and gun and electronics systems.

The Merkava 4 is slightly larger than the Merkava 3 Baz, which has been in service with the IDF since 1990. The Merkava 3 is offered for export by SIBAT based in Tel Aviv. The Merkava 4 is not offered for export but the systems and components are exported.

The tank is capable of carrying eight infantry soldiers, a Command Group or three litter patients (stretcher casualties) in addition to the tank crew of commander, loader, gunner and driver. The tank is capable of firing on the move at moving targets and has demonstrated high hit probability in firing against attack helicopters using conventional anti-tank munitions.

Major contractors include: the El Op Electro-Optic Industries subsidiary of Elbit Systems which is responsible for the fire control system; the Israel Defence Force which carries out main construction and system integration and testing; Israel Military Industries for the supply of the main gun, ballistic protection and munitions; Imco Industries for the electrical systems; Urdan Industries for the hull, main turret and castings; and IAI Ramta for protection components.

The main part of the tank production, the construction of the hull and integration of all the systems is carried out in the Israel Defence Force Workshop.

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TANK WEAPONRY
The Merkava 4 has a new all electric turret developed by Elbit and subsidiary El-Op. Only one hatch is installed in the turret, the commander's hatch.

The improved 120mm smooth bore gun has been developed by Israel Military Industries. The new gun is an advanced generation of the gun developed for the Merkava 3. A Vidco thermal shroud on the gun reduces bending of the barrel resulting from environmental and firing conditions. The gun can fire higher power munitions including new 120mm high penetration projectiles and guided shells. The loader can select semi-automatically the ammunition type. The tank carries 48 rounds of ammunition each stored in a protective container. An electrically operated revolving magazine contains 10 ready-to-fire rounds.

The range of ammunition includes APFSDS-T M711 (CL 3254), the HEAT-MP-T M325 (CL 3105) and the TPCSDS-T M324 (CL 3139) supplied by the Ammunition Group of Israel Military Industries. The gun is also capable of firing French, German or US 120mm rounds.

The tank is fitted with 7.62mm machine guns and an internally operated 60mm mortar system developed by Soltam Ltd. The mortar can fire explosive and illumination rounds to a range of 2,700m.

The protection suite includes an advanced electromagnetic threat identification and warning system.

EL OP FIRE CONTROL
The new fire control system, developed by El Op, includes very advanced features including the capability to acquire and lock onto moving targets, even airborne helicopters, while the tank itself is on the move.

The computer controlled fire control system includes line of sight stabilisation in two axes, a second-generation television sight and automatic thermal target tracker, a laser range finder, an improved thermal night vision system and a dynamic cant angle indicator. The commander's station is fitted with a stabilised panoramic day and night sight. The integrated operating system includes advanced data communications and battle management. Tadiran developed the Merkava's communications system, the inter communication system and the VRC 120 vehicular transceiver radio with embedded auxiliary receivers

GD 883 V-12 DIESEL ENGINE
The Merkava 4 is powered by a V-12 diesel engine rated at 1,500hp. The engine compartment and one fuel tank are at the front of the tank and two fuel tanks are at the back. The new engine represents a 25% increase in power compared to the 1,200hp powerpack installed on the Merkava 3.

The German company MTU manufactures the engine components and the GD 883 engine is manufactured under licensed production by General Dynamics Land Systems in the USA. The engine is transferred to Israel for installation and integration with the automatic transmission and with the engine computer control system. The tank has automatic five-gear transmission rather than four gears as in the Merkava 3. The transmission system is manufactured by Renk. The single position rotary shock absorbers are installed externally.

HULL
The redesign of the hull around the installation of the new powerpack has provided improved frontal armour protection and improvement to the driver's field of view. For improved reverse driving the driver uses a camera.

A new feature of the tank is that the fitted modular special armour covers the turret. The tank is protected against a range of threats, including air launched precision guided missiles and advanced and top attack anti-tank weapons. Automatic fire detection and suppression has been installed. The underside of the hull has been fitted with additional armour protection against mines. The driver and crew compartments are equipped with heating and cooling air conditioning and a Shalon Chemical Industries combined individual and overpressure protection systems against contamination by NBC warfare.




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#20 Mensagem por Spetsnaz » Dom Set 21, 2003 3:43 pm

M1A1 / M1A2 ABRAMS MAIN BATTLE TANK, USA
The M1A1/2 Abrams main battle tank is manufactured by General Dynamics Land Systems (GDLS). The first M1 tank was produced in 1978, the M1A1 in 1985 and the M1A2 in 1986. 3,273 M1 tanks were produced for the US Army. 4,796 M1A1 tanks were built for the US Army, 221 for the US Marines and 555 co-produced with Egypt. Egypt has ordered a further 200 M1A1 tanks with production to continue to 2005. 77 M1A2 tanks have been built for the US Army, 315 for Saudi Arabia and 218 for Kuwait. For the M1A2 Upgrade Program, over 600 M1 Abrams tanks are being upgraded to M1A2 configuration. Deliveries began in 1998.

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M1A2 SYSTEM ENHANCEMENT PACKAGE (SEP)
In February 2001, GDLS were contracted to supply 240 M1A2 tanks with a system enhancement package (SEP) by 2004. The M1A2 SEP contains an embedded version of the US Army's Force XXI command and control architecture; new Raytheon Commander's Independent Thermal Viewer (CITV) with second generation thermal imager; commander's display for digital colour terrain maps; DRS Techologies second generation GEN II TIS thermal imaging gunner’s sight with increased range; driver's integrated display and thermal management system. The US Army planned to procure a total of 1150 M1A2 SEP tanks but the US Army has decided to cancel future production of the M1A2 SEP from FY2004.

Under the Firepower Enhancement Package (FEP), DRS Techologies has also been awarded a contract for the GEN II TIS to upgrade US Marine Corps M1A1 tanks. GEN II TIS is based on the 480 x 4 SADA (Standard Advanced Dewar Assembly) detector.

M1 ABRAMS ARMAMENT
The main armament is the 120mm M256 smoothbore gun, developed by Rheinmetall GmbH of Germany. The 120mm gun fires the following ammunition: the M865 TPCSDS-T and M831 TP-T training rounds, the M8300 HEAT-MP-T and the M829 APFSDS-T which includes a depleted uranium penetrator. Textron Systems provides the Cadillac Gage gun turret drive stabilisation system.

The commander has a 12.7mm Browning M2 machine gun and the loader has a 7.62mm M240 machine gun. A 7.62mm M240 machine gun is also mounted coaxially on the right hand side of the main armament.

DEPLETED URANIUM ARMOUR
The M1A1 tank incorporates steel encased depleted uranium armour. Armour bulkheads separate the crew compartment from the fuel tanks. The top panels of the tank are designed to blow outwards in the event of penetration by a HEAT projectile. The tank is protected against nuclear, biological and chemical (NBC) warfare.

One L8A1 six-barrelled smoke grenade discharger is fitted on each side of the turret. A smoke screen can also be laid by an engine operated system.

FIRE CONTROL AND OBSERVATION

The commander's station is equipped with six periscopes, providing 360 degree view. The Raytheon Commander's Independent Thermal Viewer (CITV) provides the commander with independent stabilised day and night vision with a 360 degree view, automatic sector scanning, automatic target cueing of the gunner's sight and back-up fire control.

The M1A2 Abrams tank has a two-axis Raytheon Gunner's Primary Sight- Line of Sight (GPS-LOS) which increases the first round hit probability by providing faster target acquisition and improved gun pointing. The Thermal Imaging System (TIS) has magnification x10 narrow field of view and x3 wide field of view. The thermal image is displayed in the eyepiece of the gunner's sight together with the range measurement from a laser rangefinder. The Northrop Grumman (formerly Litton) Laser Systems Eyesafe Laser Rangefinder (ELRF) has a range accuracy to within 10m and target discrimination of 20m. The gunner also has a Kollmorgen Model 939 auxiliary sight with magnification x8 and field of view 8 degrees.

The digital fire control computer is supplied by General Dynamics - Canada (formerly Computing Devices Canada). The fire control computer automatically calculates the fire control solution based on: lead angle measurement; bend of the gun measured by the muzzle reference system; velocity measurement from a wind sensor on the roof of the turret; data from a pendulum static cant sensor located at the centre of the turret roof. The operator manually inputs data on ammunition type, temperature, and barometric pressure.

The driver has either three observation periscopes or two periscopes on either side and a central image intensifying periscope for night vision. The periscopes provide 120 degrees field of view. The DRS Technologies Driver's Vision Enhancer (DVE), AN/VSS-5, is based on a 328 x 245 element uncooled infrared detector array, operating in the 7.5 to 13 micron waveband. A Raytheon Driver's Thermal Viewer, AN/VAS-3, is installed on the M1A2 Abrams tanks for Kuwait.

PROPULSION

The M1 is equipped with a Honeywell AGT 1500 gas turbine engine. The Allison X-1100-3B transmission provides four forward and two reverse gears. The US Army has selected Honeywell International Engines and Systems and General Electric to develop a new LV100-5 gas turbine engine for the M1A2. The new engine is lighter and smaller with rapid acceleration, quieter running and no visible exhaust.




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#21 Mensagem por Marechal-do-ar » Dom Set 21, 2003 3:52 pm

O melhor tanque? Bem, entre esses cinco depende da situação, se for para combater infantes contra minas e lança-rojões eu fico com o Merkava, se for pra combater outros tanques Osório sem dúvida, mas se colocar M1 e Leopard 2... Ai Leopard 2 pra tudo.




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...

#22 Mensagem por Super Flanker » Dom Set 21, 2003 6:57 pm

Opz, só agora reparei que colequei 2 vezes Challenger...no Challenger 4 era pra ser Abrams...

Falows.




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Re: ...

#23 Mensagem por Marechal-do-ar » Dom Set 21, 2003 8:15 pm

Super Flanker escreveu:Opz, só agora reparei que colequei 2 vezes Challenger...no Challenger 4 era pra ser Abrams...

Falows.

E Leopard 2? Aquele frances? O T-80?




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#24 Mensagem por Super Flanker » Dom Set 21, 2003 8:41 pm

Opa, blz?.
Não da para colocar mais de 5 na enquete.
O frances que você fala é o Amx-40?
Eu deveria ter colocado em vez do Challenger, o Leopard 2, parece ser melhor que o tanque ingles.
Já o T-80, já que tem o T-90 na enquete não é preciso colocar o T-80, que deve ser inferir que o T-90.


Falows.




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Re: ...

#25 Mensagem por Marechal-do-ar » Seg Set 22, 2003 2:06 pm

Super Flanker escreveu:Opa, blz?.
Não da para colocar mais de 5 na enquete.
O frances que você fala é o Amx-40?
Eu deveria ter colocado em vez do Challenger, o Leopard 2, parece ser melhor que o tanque ingles.
Já o T-80, já que tem o T-90 na enquete não é preciso colocar o T-80, que deve ser inferir que o T-90.


Falows.

O T-90 é baseado no T-72 e o T-80 é um tanque novo, acho que da pra fazer uma boa comparações entre eles, me referi ao lecrerc (ao algo assim) mas acho que o AMX-40 tambem devia participar dessa enquete, faz assim duas enquetes um com tanques com mais de 60 tons e outra com tanques com menos de 60 tons.




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Re: ...

#26 Mensagem por Spetsnaz » Seg Set 22, 2003 3:37 pm

Marechal-do-ar escreveu:
Super Flanker escreveu:Opa, blz?.
Não da para colocar mais de 5 na enquete.
O frances que você fala é o Amx-40?
Eu deveria ter colocado em vez do Challenger, o Leopard 2, parece ser melhor que o tanque ingles.
Já o T-80, já que tem o T-90 na enquete não é preciso colocar o T-80, que deve ser inferir que o T-90.


Falows.

O T-90 é baseado no T-72 e o T-80 é um tanque novo, acho que da pra fazer uma boa comparações entre eles, me referi ao lecrerc (ao algo assim) mas acho que o AMX-40 tambem devia participar dessa enquete, faz assim duas enquetes um com tanques com mais de 60 tons e outra com tanques com menos de 60 tons.


O T-90 é melhor que o T-80U ... intaum basta ter o T-90 lá ... mesmo sendo derivado do T-72 ele é muito melhor que o mesmo.. e é melhor que o T-80U que é a ultima versão do T-80 ... existe um update do T-80 como foi demonstrado nos textos anteriores... o "Black Eagle" .. esse sim é melhor que o T-90 .. mas não vem ao caso pois não está operacional .. e provavelmentente não estará operacional ao menos nas forças russas... é um projeto mais voltado para exportação ... bem que o Brasil poderia se interessar hahahaaha :roll:

PS. AMX 40 fede hahaha...O Leclerc eh um tanque interessante.. mesmo eu não sabendo nada sobre ele.. me parece um bom tanque...




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Re: ...

#27 Mensagem por Marechal-do-ar » Seg Set 22, 2003 4:29 pm

Spetsnaz escreveu:O T-90 é melhor que o T-80U ... intaum basta ter o T-90 lá ... mesmo sendo derivado do T-72 ele é muito melhor que o mesmo.. e é melhor que o T-80U que é a ultima versão do T-80 ... existe um update do T-80 como foi demonstrado nos textos anteriores... o "Black Eagle" .. esse sim é melhor que o T-90 .. mas não vem ao caso pois não está operacional .. e provavelmentente não estará operacional ao menos nas forças russas... é um projeto mais voltado para exportação ... bem que o Brasil poderia se interessar hahahaaha :roll:

PS. AMX 40 fede hahaha...O Leclerc eh um tanque interessante.. mesmo eu não sabendo nada sobre ele.. me parece um bom tanque...

O AMX realmente fede, mas os T-80 e T-90 são tecnicamente quase iguais.




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Re: ...

#28 Mensagem por Spetsnaz » Seg Set 22, 2003 6:46 pm

Marechal-do-ar escreveu:
Spetsnaz escreveu:O T-90 é melhor que o T-80U ... intaum basta ter o T-90 lá ... mesmo sendo derivado do T-72 ele é muito melhor que o mesmo.. e é melhor que o T-80U que é a ultima versão do T-80 ... existe um update do T-80 como foi demonstrado nos textos anteriores... o "Black Eagle" .. esse sim é melhor que o T-90 .. mas não vem ao caso pois não está operacional .. e provavelmentente não estará operacional ao menos nas forças russas... é um projeto mais voltado para exportação ... bem que o Brasil poderia se interessar hahahaaha :roll:

PS. AMX 40 fede hahaha...O Leclerc eh um tanque interessante.. mesmo eu não sabendo nada sobre ele.. me parece um bom tanque...

O AMX realmente fede, mas os T-80 e T-90 são tecnicamente quase iguais.


Acho que não cara... soh os sistemas de defesa do T-90 tão mor cara na frente do AMX e de praticamente tdos os tanques que existem .. ERA Kontakt-5, Arena, Shtora-1 entre outras coisas.. lançamento de ATGM pelo canhão ... mobilidade ... sei lá... tenho lá minhas enormes duvidas em relação a essa sua afirmação.. mais a gente soh saberia a verdade colocando um AMX e um T-90 no ring com duas tripulações extremamentes semelhantes em um combate em condição total de igualdade ... mesmo assim eu acho que o T-90 ia vancer ...




Spetsnaz
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Re: ...

#29 Mensagem por Spetsnaz » Seg Set 22, 2003 6:52 pm

Spetsnaz escreveu:
Marechal-do-ar escreveu:
Spetsnaz escreveu:O T-90 é melhor que o T-80U ... intaum basta ter o T-90 lá ... mesmo sendo derivado do T-72 ele é muito melhor que o mesmo.. e é melhor que o T-80U que é a ultima versão do T-80 ... existe um update do T-80 como foi demonstrado nos textos anteriores... o "Black Eagle" .. esse sim é melhor que o T-90 .. mas não vem ao caso pois não está operacional .. e provavelmentente não estará operacional ao menos nas forças russas... é um projeto mais voltado para exportação ... bem que o Brasil poderia se interessar hahahaaha :roll:

PS. AMX 40 fede hahaha...O Leclerc eh um tanque interessante.. mesmo eu não sabendo nada sobre ele.. me parece um bom tanque...

O AMX realmente fede, mas os T-80 e T-90 são tecnicamente quase iguais.


Acho que não cara... soh os sistemas de defesa do T-90 tão mor cara na frente do AMX e de praticamente tdos os tanques que existem .. ERA Kontakt-5, Arena, Shtora-1 entre outras coisas.. lançamento de ATGM pelo canhão ... mobilidade ... sei lá... tenho lá minhas enormes duvidas em relação a essa sua afirmação.. mais a gente soh saberia a verdade colocando um AMX e um T-90 no ring com duas tripulações extremamentes semelhantes em um combate em condição total de igualdade ... mesmo assim eu acho que o T-90 ia vancer ...


Putas.... hahua eu li errado oq vc escreveu.. mais deixa assim fiko mor bunitinho o texto.. maus ae =-P




Spetsnaz
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#30 Mensagem por Spetsnaz » Seg Set 22, 2003 6:54 pm

Bom arrumando oq eu falei..

Eu acho que o T-80 e o T-90 não são tecnicamente iguais.. talvez parecidos.. mas o T-90 possue uma gama de equipamentos novos e sistemas novos que o T-80 não possue.. talvez algumas de suas ultimas versões tenham recebido alguns desses sistemas ... que já vem no T-90 ... bom que são parecidos são ... mais eu ficaria num T-90 se tivesse que escolher entre os 2 :wink:




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